BMW X5 40e White smoke at startup after 3 or 4 days notinuse.

[RodG]

Hello all.

A 2016 X5 40e.  

If the car has been standing unused for several days, and it is then started on the petrol engine, a cloud of white smoke issues from the exhaust.   Most of the smoke  comes from the passenger side tailpipe.  It clears after 10 to15 seconds  and then no smoke is visible until the next time I leave it unused for a few days.

I'm thinking it might be to do with the engine breather valve ?

A mechanic wants  me to address the error code on the fuel tank pressure sensor first in case it is the cause of the problem - an expensive job.

I see that there is a recall on this sensor from BMW USA but my local BMW main dealer says that it doesn't apply to European cars (?).

Where can I find info on BMW recalls/extended warranties for UK/Irish cars ?

Any info about fixing  the white smoke problem would be most welcome.

Thanks

 

Rod

 

 

[Greydog]

Morning Rod

Welcome to the Forum

Never had one of these to look at or play with so this is just me thinking out loud

1. White smoke, experience tells me it is either water vapour caused by condensation in the exhaust or as suggested possibly an engine breather fault. The key would be smell if it is breather related it will have a strong smell also breather issues normally manifest themselves after the engine has been ticking over for a while. Water vapour will have very little smell and clear quickly as the exhaust warms up.

2. You say a mechanic wants to investigate/correct a fuel tank pressure sensor fault? Logic tells me that a fuel delivery issue would cause either over fuelling (a strong smell of unburnt fuel) or very poor erratic running along with erratic performance/MPG. Have you had the issue investigated by a BMW Dealer or BMW Specialist? If this sensor issue is cleared, does it return straight away? On most models the fuel tank pressure sensor is faily easy to access test and change if needed.

BMW like many other manufacturers tend to aknowledge even possible Warranty issues faster in the USA due to the different legal system, while here in Europe as you have discovered things are very different.

Dave

[RodG]

3 hours ago, Greydog said:

Morning Rod

Welcome to the Forum

Never had one of these to look at or play with so this is just me thinking out loud

1. White smoke, experience tells me it is either water vapour caused by condensation in the exhaust or as suggested possibly an engine breather fault. The key would be smell if it is breather related it will have a strong smell also breather issues normally manifest themselves after the engine has been ticking over for a while. Water vapour will have very little smell and clear quickly as the exhaust warms up.

2. You say a mechanic wants to investigate/correct a fuel tank pressure sensor fault? Logic tells me that a fuel delivery issue would cause either over fuelling (a strong smell of unburnt fuel) or very poor erratic running along with erratic performance/MPG. Have you had the issue investigated by a BMW Dealer or BMW Specialist? If this sensor issue is cleared, does it return straight away? On most models the fuel tank pressure sensor is faily easy to access test and change if needed.

BMW like many other manufacturers tend to aknowledge even possible Warranty issues faster in the USA due to the different legal system, while here in Europe as you have discovered things are very different.

Dave

 

[RodG]

19 hours ago, RodG said:

Hello all.

A 2016 X5 40e.  

If the car has been standing unused for several days, and it is then started on the petrol engine, a cloud of white smoke issues from the exhaust.   Most of the smoke  comes from the passenger side tailpipe.  It clears after 10 to15 seconds  and then no smoke is visible until the next time I leave it unused for a few days.

I'm thinking it might be to do with the engine breather valve ?

A mechanic wants  me to address the error code on the fuel tank pressure sensor first in case it is the cause of the problem - an expensive job.

I see that there is a recall on this sensor from BMW USA but my local BMW main dealer says that it doesn't apply to European cars (?).

Where can I find info on BMW recalls/extended warranties for UK/Irish cars ?

Any info about fixing  the white smoke problem would be most welcome.

Thanks

 

Rod

 

 

 

[RodG]

Afternoon  Dave.

 

Thanks for the reply.

The car has only been sitting for  a couple of days so I can't get it to exhibit the fault just yet.

However, I started it on the petrol motor and there was some white smoke from the passenger side exhaust pipe (which has a lot more soot on it than the driver's side one). The fumes smelled slightly of petrol - like normal exhaust really, but smokier.

I think I saw somewhere that there is a gate valve in the exhaust system somewhere that directs gases to the passenger side pipe but I  don't know if that's true.

When the car has been running there's no visible smoke from either tailpipe.

WRT  the fuel tank pressure sensor, my mechanic tells me its a 5 hour job involving dropping the fuel tank, so that's expensive (£UK400).

I don't know the cost of a breather valve replacement

 

 

[Greydog]

Take a look at www.realoem.com put the last 7 digits of your Vin into the search box it will call up your model then search the fuel tank section. It will have small, exploded drawings which should help understand where stuff fits and how.

I will take a look on my garage laptop INPA/ISTA BMW Diagnostics has both TIS (technical information system) and WIS (workshop information system) built in so there may be something there.

Just spoken with a friend I have in the USA and it seems BMW did in fact put an extended 10year/120k warranty on this part but it was not a recall apparently just support if a customer had an issue.

It may be worth talking to BMW UK customer services if you haven't already to see if you can get some help there

Dave

[RodG]

That's very useful stuff !

I've called a local BMW main dealer (I'm in Ireland), and am awaiting a call back.

In the meantime I've put a Carista OBD2 device on the car and it reports several codes - here are the relevant ones.

Hybrid pressure refuelling        D04C1E

Explained as X5 PHEV 13Rex and fuel tank pressure sensor.

Engine                                       21B0000  which seems to refer to the same fault as D04C1E

That lead me to a post on Bimmerpost from 2014 which talked about  "a long fuel pressure release wait time"  (That's the delay between you pressing the fuel cap flap release button and the flap actually unlocking).  It takes about 25 -30 seconds on my car.

So I'm thinking that the fuel tank pressure issue is not connected to the exhaust smoke problem

[Greydog]

Morning 

I would think issues at the fuel tank would normally manifest themselves with erratic running or poor starting, that is how I have experienced fuel tank pressure issues in the past, oh for the days when you just swapped the fuel cap!!

Talked to my friend in the US who tells me your exhaust is a single pipe system to the rear box which has twin tail pipes. The exhaust flap was fitted to the right-hand side to reduce noise during the warmup period and from your description is working OK. The turbo and DPF retain a lot of heat after shutting down, so condensation is the probable cause.

He has seen leaks at the turbo cooling system that gave white vapour, but the cooling system also needed topping up

Hope this helps not hinders 

Dave

 

 

[RodG]

Good morning Dave.

Thanks for all the follow-up work you're doing.

That sort of confirms that the fuel pressure fault is not associated with the smoke problem.

I'd be more relaxed  about a small bit of white vapour but after the car has been sitting for 3 or 4 days there is A LOT !

The first time I saw it, I thought the turbo had let go, the cloud was so large and dense! When the white cloud dissipated after maybe 10-15 seconds and a bit of reving, my heart rate slowly returned from the 180 bpm it had hit. 😉

I might investigate the cost of replacing the oil breather valve and see if that helps.

Car due for its NCT -that's an MOT in the UK and I don't want to fail on emissions.

Thanks again

[Greydog]

No problem Rod

I hope you can get it resolved and no emission faults for the NCT My X5 3.0d goes in on Thursday for it's MOT

The X5 4.6is passed in March

All Good Fun

Dave

 

[RodG]

Fingers crossed

Funny what rabbit holes you fall  down when you start chasing faults.

I now have to chase a "missing" fuse box ! 😉

Thanks again

 

Rod

[dublinbren]

Did you find the fix problem ? as I have the same issue 

[RodG]

Sorry for being so late in responding.

I took the car to a mechanic and he feels that the problem is a leaking oil seal on the turbo, which is bad news.

€5K is what he estimates using original BMW turbo replacement.

[Greydog]

Get a second opinion on the turbo normally an oil seal gives Blue smoke not white plus it wouldn't clear

Dave

[RodG]

Thanks Dave.

I'm going to to a second mechanic and get his view on the problem.

I also want to investigate whether its ok to have my turbo reconditioned rather than going for a new BMW unit.  If I can do that, it would save a lot of money.

 

[Greydog]

Morning Rod

I wouldn't hesitate on a refurbished Turbo as often if there has been a common Fail point the Refurbishes  have found an upgrade a fix. 

As BMW tend to retain any failed part finding someone to do it may be your challenge

Good Hunting

Dave

[RodG]

Hello Dave.

Since the turbo is still in the car and its driving ok, (apart from the gearbox), the plan is to get a non BMW garage to do the work.  I've ID'ed a couple of turbo specialists fairly near me.  They seem to want the turbo out of the car and brought to them, which is understandable.

I was a bit shocked when the mechanic ( he has a very good rep), who quoted me €5k explained that the biggest cost item in the bill was not the labour, but the replacement turbo !

[Greydog]

That is because BMW retain failed damaged units and supply only NEW at their price and require the old unit as exchange.

I have a son in the trade and he could sell no end of BMW turbo's if he could get them!!

But a good Turbo specialist should have no problems after all a turbo isnt exactly rare on cars today

Good Luck

Dave

[RodG]

Thanks for the confidence boost Dave. 🙂

I'll start with the gearbox, I think and let you know how I get on.

I'm regretting trading in my E70 diesel for this thing, but the road tax on the  hybrid sort of blinded me 😞

Thanks again

Rod

[Hope]

I have the exact problem even on the same year and model.  Did anyone figure out what was causing the white smoke?

[Seanc]

Hey Rodg, I'm in Ireland too and have the same problem. Did you get sorted? 

[CarloL]

Also in Ireland, Same issue , first time happening today after 1 year of ownership, 2016 X5 40e. Just serviced by main dealer last week 

Was sitting for 24 hours, in electric mode, ICE kicked in from cold (light throttle), huge plum of white smoke covering the car behind, hopefully just condensation in the exhaust  

Do not like the idea , stone cold engines kicking in and being asked to load up , oil intervals of 30k km; When you are out of warranty issues will arise to wear n tear

Did anybody figure out a possible cause , fix?

I sitll need to try and replicate , see if I can get any smell from the smoke

[Seanc]

On 8/16/2023 at 12:25 PM, CarloL said:

Also in Ireland, Same issue , first time happening today after 1 year of ownership, 2016 X5 40e. Just serviced by main dealer last week 

Was sitting for 24 hours, in electric mode, ICE kicked in from cold (light throttle), huge plum of white smoke covering the car behind, hopefully just condensation in the exhaust  

Do not like the idea , stone cold engines kicking in and being asked to load up , oil intervals of 30k km; When you are out of warranty issues will arise to wear n tear

Did anybody figure out a possible cause , fix?

I sitll need to try and replicate , see if I can get any smell from the smoke

Did you get this sorted? I'd mine at a main dealer, they changed a oil line to the turbo but the smoke is still there after I leave it undriven for a few days

[CarloL]

On 9/29/2023 at 8:12 PM, Seanc said:

Did you get this sorted? I'd mine at a main dealer, they changed a oil line to the turbo but the smoke is still there after I leave it undriven for a few days

I could not replicate the issue 

[Seanc]

Thanks for getting back to me