A paddling pool in the rear of my 08 reg 635d Convertible !!

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

Hi to you all out there.  The other day while about to vacuum out the car I discovered a considerable amount of water in the rear behind the driver's seat.

After an hour of attempting to clear it using a turkey baster and a giant car sponge, I managed to clear most of the water.

My local BMW Dealership printed me off a diagram showing the 8 drainage point locations but the apparent amount of carpet etc that I have to shift for access is a little difficult for me !

Have I misunderstood, and the drainage points are actually beneath the little black button-tops that are visible when the boot lid is raised ?

My local BMW dealership has quoted me £162.00 incl VAT to clear them and reckons that it is a one-hour work.

 

Thank you in anticipation.

 

[jenksy0198]

Ive only ever had an issue with my 650 soft top but that was in the soft top stow away area, not the car but that problem was due to blocked drainage points. There are 4 of them in there. I now blow them through on a regular basis with a weak warm bleach solution using a baster as it happens. So, whilst not exactly your case but was the drain points that were the issue.     

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

1 hour ago, jenksy0198 said:

Ive only ever had an issue with my 650 soft top but that was in the soft top stow away area, not the car but that problem was due to blocked drainage points. There are 4 of them in there. I now blow them through on a regular basis with a weak warm bleach solution using a baster as it happens. So, whilst not exactly your case but was the drain points that were the issue.     

Hi jenksy. I have it on reliable grounds indeed from the main dealer here in Southport that there are 8 drainage points as stated in the third sentence of my post !!

I have a print-out from the main dealer showing the location of the drains.

Perhaps I have misunderstood the diagram, albeit I have had the hood in the partial open/closed position several times and cannot see any drain points.

[Greydog]

Morning Men

Looking at the diagram I would say hood up boot lid open and the are in the Hood starage area. Not much help I am afraid as I have never had to explore this issue I would be more concerned about where it is getting in than letting it out

I had a convertable in the 60's it leaked and was draughty a short ownership, same with Sunroofs when they became the big thing in the 70's. Only a few of my cars have had sunroofs since the 80's/90's and none of my X5's have had/hve holes in the roof. If I want the wind in my hair I stand on the Beach 🤣

Dave

[jenksy0198]

Ok , I agree with the BMW drawing although yours and mine will be different, the locations look familiar. I don't know the Ci set up but I have never had any water getting into the actual car cockpit, only the soft top stow away area, served by the drains. This stow away area is not carpeted either.

Ill send some pics so you can see the differences and the drain points as best I can identify them.

It sounds like you have water getting into the main cockpit of the car, especially if you have to lift carpet as described in your missive. Never had that issue.     

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

4 hours ago, Greydog said:

Morning Men

Looking at the diagram I would say hood up boot lid open and the are in the Hood starage area. Not much help I am afraid as I have never had to explore this issue I would be more concerned about where it is getting in than letting it out

I had a convertable in the 60's it leaked and was draughty a short ownership, same with Sunroofs when they became the big thing in the 70's. Only a few of my cars have had sunroofs since the 80's/90's and none of my X5's have had/hve holes in the roof. If I want the wind in my hair I stand on the Beach 🤣

Dave

Hi Dave. To my mind, the issue of the water getting in is like looking for a needle in a haystack and must logically be linked to a drain or drains being blocked.

Hopefully the main dealer technician will locate an entry point or points and deal with it/them and clear the 8 drain points that are identified on the diagram.

 

 

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

1 hour ago, jenksy0198 said:

Ok , I agree with the BMW drawing although yours and mine will be different, the locations look familiar. I don't know the Ci set up but I have never had any water getting into the actual car cockpit, only the soft top stow away area, served by the drains. This stow away area is not carpeted either.

Ill send some pics so you can see the differences and the drain points as best I can identify them.

It sounds like you have water getting into the main cockpit of the car, especially if you have to lift carpet as described in your missive. Never had that issue.     

Hi Paul. Why should/would your 650i be different to my 635d if they are both convertibles and presumably the same body with the only difference being the engine size and type ?

Can I assume by your post that your car is actually a 650i convertible ?

I am intrigued and will look forward to you posting some images !!

[jenksy0198]

Yes 650i convertible, my error by the way I though I read 325Ci. mine and yours should be near enough identical. Here are the images I mentioned.

pic 1 - back corner of the storage area - 1 each side

pic 2 - literally adjacent to the rear strut pillar 

Pic 3 - rear corner nearest to the rear of the vehicle right side

Pic 4 - as above left side

Pic 5 - same as pic 1 but other side - this location is tucked right back immediately under the folding brackets.

I am not aware of any other drains under that protective cover as that does not lift up. There have been times I have had several inches of water in there sloshing about but none has actually entered the passenger compartment. As I said I do look to blow through these drains on a regular basis.

Hope this helps.

I have had water getting into the boot area carpet, this rides under that black plastic cover you can see in pics 3/4. and drips into the boot. BTW Im in Formby and more than happy to meet and talk it through if that helps.

 

The whole system of the softtop seal onto the car body is not watertight hence the need for drains but these have to be kept clear otherwise water does build up and can get into the boot area as noted above.     

 

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

3 hours ago, jenksy0198 said:

Yes 650i convertible, my error by the way I though I read 325Ci. mine and yours should be near enough identical. Here are the images I mentioned.

pic 1 - back corner of the storage area - 1 each side

pic 2 - literally adjacent to the rear strut pillar 

Pic 3 - rear corner nearest to the rear of the vehicle right side

Pic 4 - as above left side

Pic 5 - same as pic 1 but other side - this location is tucked right back immediately under the folding brackets.

I am not aware of any other drains under that protective cover as that does not lift up. There have been times I have had several inches of water in there sloshing about but none has actually entered the passenger compartment. As I said I do look to blow through these drains on a regular basis.

Hope this helps.

I have had water getting into the boot area carpet, this rides under that black plastic cover you can see in pics 3/4. and drips into the boot. BTW Im in Formby and more than happy to meet and talk it through if that helps.

 

The whole system of the softtop seal onto the car body is not watertight hence the need for drains but these have to be kept clear otherwise water does build up and can get into the boot area as noted above.     

 

Hi Paul. I have sent you a message on the system messaging service.

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

Well hello again.

I have just collected my E64 635d Convertible Auto from my local Halliwell Jones after having had the unwanted and involuntary paddling pool investigated.

Despite the print off of the drainage points showing that there are 8 in total - it turned out that there were actually only 6.

It was reported that there was very little that came out leaving them all running freely.

It was discovered that the water would appear to have been coming in at the front !! and possibly from around the brake servo mounting.

 

The next few days will/should bring a further opportunity for a re-examination of the situation - we are forested to have heavy rain in my local area !!

I will keep you posted.

 

PS. I was very pleasantly surprised when I was presented with a considerably reduced bill from what was originally quoted.

The car also was washed and a mini valet was done leaving the car looking like it had just come out of the showroom.

Edited September 25 by ARoosterinaRoadster
Punctuation check.

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

Well hello again and a good but very wet morning to you all out there !!

I had the rear drains cleared last Wednesday - 25th Sept and the paddling pool has returned !

I am fairly convinced that there must be a blockage somewhere up-front.

Has the forum got any other positive ideas as to where ?

The car has gone in for some minor cosmetic paintwork to be attended to and I am not expecting it back until Wednesday/Thursday.

[Greydog]

Morning John

How annoying you could check www.realoem.com put the last 7 digits into the search box it will call up your model then check the Body section for drain locations. While the site is an Online BMW parts list the small exploded drawings can be great fot locating things

Obviously it will give part numbers if replacements are needed 

Good Luck

Dave

 

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

28 minutes ago, Greydog said:

Morning John

How annoying you could check www.realoem.com put the last 7 digits into the search box it will call up your model then check the Body section for drain locations. While the site is an Online BMW parts list the small exploded drawings can be great fot locating things

Obviously it will give part numbers if replacements are needed 

Good Luck

Dave

 

Hi again Dave. Thank you for the heads-up.

I did what you suggested and the site search produced a series of sketches including one for bodywork but did not show any actual drain points.

My local BMW dealership has suggested that the car goes back in and the ingress of water is investigated as it is most likely getting in through the bulkhead - that could be expensive and he was talking of around a thousand pounds because of removing the carpet on the driver's side and testing with water and seeing whether it is entering from the area of the bulkhead.

[Greydog]

Ouch 

Roof seals and window and door seals would be my starting point if the water is coming from the bulk head surley the front carpets would be wet as well? 

Fingers crossed on it being an easy fix 

Dave

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

16 minutes ago, Greydog said:

Ouch 

Roof seals and window and door seals would be my starting point if the water is coming from the bulk head surley the front carpets would be wet as well? 

Fingers crossed on it being an easy fix 

Dave

Hi again Dave.

The carpet on the driver's side does feel damp when you go right up into the pedal area but again there is no evidence of leaks from above;the backing on the carpet is seemingly quite water-resistant - that is going by the loose rear footwell mats that have the "Velcro" type circles attached to them.

The car has not been showing any leaks from around the doors - keep in mind that the car is a convertible and only has two doors !

The local BMW Dealership suggested that the membrane could be compromised or the lower door seals were damaged but that has also been checked and there is no water present on the inside of the door sill or carpet.

There is no evidence of roof seals leaking either and especially as there is only the one at the front and that closers down and the locking clamps are fully functional.

There is no water on any part of the inside leather trim etc.

I have booked the car into a BMW Specialist in St Helens but they can only look at it on Tuesday 9th October.

Until then, I will just have to keep bailing the water out with a combination of a Turkey Baster and a giant car sponge.

At least for the next few days it is indoors at the paint shop !

[displayme]

Bummer about the recurring leak. Hopefully the specialist can pinpoint the source.
 

[Greydog]

Morning John

As you seem to be getting so much water you would think there should be clear evidence ?? Hopefully the specialist will find it.

As an after thought is the boot clear? I have seen an amazing amount of water in the boot of a 5 series that was coming from rear light seals failing, clutching at straws really

Dave

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

18 hours ago, displayme said:

Bummer about the recurring leak. Hopefully the specialist can pinpoint the source.
 

Hi Jez. Yes, I really do hope that they will get to the bottom of the issue.

The decision to take it to a specialist instead of the main dealer again was purely on cost - Main Dealer v a recommended Specialist.

Having spoken with the receptionist at the specialist even before it went to the main dealer, she was fully familiar with the issue.

The initial visit to the main dealer was simply on the distance from one to the other and the logistics of getting back home and returning again when the car was sorted.

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

12 hours ago, Greydog said:

Morning John

As you seem to be getting so much water you would think there should be clear evidence ?? Hopefully the specialist will find it.

As an after thought is the boot clear? I have seen an amazing amount of water in the boot of a 5 series that was coming from rear light seals failing, clutching at straws really

Dave

Hi again Dave. The boot was totally dry, but in any event it is also a lot lower and with no obvious route for the passage of water into the rear footwell.

The car is in with the painter at present and the visit to the specialist is scheduled/book-in for next Tuesday early AM.

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

Hi again to you all out there.

Just a few thoughts before the E64 goes into the BMW Specialist on Tuesday next week.

The car went into my local Halliwell Jones last week and they seemingly only cleared 6 drain points in the rear, although their own diagram shows there to be 8 !!

Why so ?

I watched a very interesting YouTube video yesterday which confirmed that there were indeed 8 drains in the rear. I will take this up with the main dealer tomorrow, (Thursday) and see what transpires !!

The video also showed very interestingly the clearing of the drains in the front - what a palaver;especially the drainage points in the front wings.

I really am at 6's and 7's whether to keep the car or move it on once the water issue is sorted - well I have until Spring 2025 because it is now not such a good time to sell privately and the trade want it for nothing ! as is their style of doing business.

If sold privately,what would a very,very nice 2008 plate E64 635d Auto with 134,800 recorded miles and now me as the 8th owner fetch ?

Edited October 2 by ARoosterinaRoadster
Add a small addition bit of info.

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

Hi to you all out there.  Just a midstream update.

The car went into the BMW Specialist and they have declared that the carpets and seats have got to come out of the car so that they can conduct a water test.

Despite the fact that the water is only affecting the driver side (RH) of the car and collecting in the rear footwell !!

I am perplexed - they have also determined that the front drainage points were not blocked,there are three of them plus one in each wing;this was confirmed on a very recent YouTube video that I looked at before the car went in.

It is probably going to be a few days before I get the car back again as they are talking about drying out the carpets before putting it all back together.

[Greydog]

Hi John

What a proverbial PITA 

Dave

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

57 minutes ago, Greydog said:

Hi John

What a proverbial PITA 

Dave

Hi Dave. Yes,I cannot agree more but the saving grace is that I have now seen the floor of my 635d and the amount of sound proofing that there is.

Under the carpet and sound proofing there are cables that eventually would have given rise to electrical issues as the car appears to have been collecting water for some time - it was only because of the slightly "nose-up" way that my car is parked that the water eventually became obvious.

Graham Martin Automotive (St Helens) has removed the driver's seat and the rear seat squab enabling the carpet etc to be partially removed and turned back so that it can be dried out properly otherwise the smell would become rather an issue - especially as we are now into Autumn and approaching Winter/Spring and very little hope of a warm car that would help in natural drying.

I will see what the situation is when the car is back;Monday early PM is the day that I am due to collect and I have given it a fair few miles of reappraisal.

What I am rather surprised about is that there is no part of any service schedule that includes early simple drain checks, especially with convertibles which I am sure are a great deal more likely to have drainage issues throughout their lives.

[ARoosterinaRoadster]

Hi to you all out there.

The E64 rides again after being at the BMW Specialist since Tuesday 8th October.

The issue has been sorted out and the car is back-together.

I am now £399.00 lighter for the work that has been carried out and hopefully it will not be an issue again during my ownership.

It is coming to something when there has got to be a real problem with drains being blocked and the inside of the car becomes a paddling pool on tyres before attention is needed.

The Mercedes SLK's that I have had in the past all had easily visible drains and were rather easily cleared using a suitable rod attached to a low-powered cordless drill.

What is the expression - KISS. For the ones that are unfamiliar - Keep It Simple Stupid !

[Greydog]

Glad your sorted at last John maybe now you can enjoy your car at last 😁

For what it is worth Mercedes haven't always been so stellar I owned a 98 AMG E55 Estate which in 2000 was actuelly replaced by Mercedes due to rust issues!! The cars were fabulous but rust was a real problem with both the E55's changed it for a CLS AMG 63 Estate. Moved to BMW X5 when we sold the Horse Lorry and down sized to a Horse trailer. I never liked the shape of the ML

Enjoy your Beemer 

Dave